27a9–28a2

Question 1

Συνεπισκέψασθε δή, ὦ ἄνδρες, ᾗ μοι φαίνεται ταῦτα λέγειν· | σὺ δὲ ἡμῖν ἀπόκριναι, ὦ Μέλητε. ὑμεῖς δέ, ὅπερ κατ’ ἀρχὰς ὑμᾶς παρῃτησάμην, μέμνησθέ μοι μὴ θορυβεῖν ἐὰν ἐν τῷ εἰωθότι τρόπῳ τοὺς λόγους ποιῶμαι.

Ἔστιν ὅστις ἀνθρώπων, ὦ Μέλητε, ἀνθρώπεια μὲν νομίζει πράγματ’ εἶναι, ἀνθρώπους δὲ οὐ νομίζει; | ἀποκρινέσθω, ὦ ἄνδρες, καὶ μὴ ἄλλα καὶ ἄλλα θορυβείτω· ἔσθ’ ὅστις ἵππους μὲν οὐ νομίζει, ἱππικὰ δὲ πράγματα; ἢ αὐλητὰς μὲν οὐ νομίζει εἶναι, αὐλητικὰ δὲ πράγματα; οὐκ ἔστιν, ὦ ἄριστε ἀνδρῶν· εἰ μὴ σὺ βούλει ἀποκρίνεσθαι, ἐγὼ σοὶ λέγω καὶ τοῖς ἄλλοις τουτοισί. ἀλλὰ τὸ ἐπὶ τούτῳ γε ἀπόκριναι· ἔσθ’ ὅστις δαιμόνια μὲν νομίζει πράγματ’ εἶναι, δαίμονας δὲ οὐ νομίζει;

Answer 1

Let us review, gent, what he appears to me to mean by this. Answer us, Mel. And all you here remember what I begged of you from the beginning, don’t heckle me if I use arguments in my accustomed way.

Is there any humanbeing, Mel, who thinks that human affairs exist but don’t believe in humans? Let him keep answering, gent, and don’t heckle again and again. Are there those who don’t believe in horses, but do recognise things related to horses? Or don’t rec flute players but do flute-playing? There is not, gent, if you don’t wish to answer, I am telling you and everyone here. But answer the main question (the after-this (question)). Is there anyone believe in spiritual matters but does not believe in spirits?

Question 2

Οὐκ ἔστιν.

Ὡς ὤνησας ὅτι μόγις ἀπεκρίνω ὑπὸ τουτωνὶ ἀναγκαζόμενος. | οὐκοῦν δαιμόνια μὲν φῄς με καὶ νομίζειν καὶ διδάσκειν, εἴτ’ οὖν καινὰ εἴτε παλαιά, ἀλλ’ οὖν δαιμόνιά γε νομίζω κατὰ τὸν σὸν λόγον, καὶ ταῦτα καὶ διωμόσω ἐν τῇ ἀντιγραφῇ. εἰ δὲ δαιμόνια νομίζω, καὶ δαίμονας δήπου πολλὴ ἀνάγκη νομίζειν μέ ἐστιν· οὐχ οὕτως ἔχει; ἔχει δή· | τίθημι γάρ σε ὁμολογοῦντα, ἐπειδὴ οὐκ ἀποκρίνῃ. τοὺς δὲ δαίμονας οὐχὶ ἤτοι θεούς γε ἡγούμεθα ἢ θεῶν παῖδας; φῂς ἢ οὔ;

Answer 2

There is not.

How helpful that you scarcely replied under pressure from these people. Therefore, you say that I both believe and teach spirits, whether new or old, but I do believe in spirits according to your argument, and you even swore this in your indictment. And if I rec spiritual matters, then clearly I must rec that there are spirits, is that so? Of course, it is. For I place you agreeing with me since you don’t answer. And do we not truly consider spirits to be gods, or children of gods? Do you agree or not?

Question 3

Πάνυ γε.

Οὐκοῦν εἴπερ δαίμονας ἡγοῦμαι, ὡς σὺ φῄς, | εἰ μὲν θεοί τινές εἰσιν οἱ δαίμονες, τοῦτ’ ἂν εἴη ὃ ἐγώ φημί σε αἰνίττεσθαι καὶ χαριεντίζεσθαι, θεοὺς οὐχ ἡγούμενον φάναι με θεοὺς αὖ ἡγεῖσθαι πάλιν, ἐπειδήπερ γε δαίμονας ἡγοῦμαι· εἰ δ’ αὖ οἱ δαίμονες θεῶν παῖδές εἰσιν νόθοι τινὲς ἢ ἐκ νυμφῶν ἢ ἔκ τινων ἄλλων ὧν δὴ καὶ λέγονται, | τίς ἂν ἀνθρώπων θεῶν μὲν παῖδας ἡγοῖτο εἶναι, θεοὺς δὲ μή; ὁμοίως γὰρ ἂν ἄτοπον εἴη ὥσπερ ἂν εἴ τις ἵππων μὲν παῖδας ἡγοῖτο [ἢ]3 καὶ ὄνων, τοὺς ἡμιόνους, ἵππους δὲ καὶ ὄνους μὴ ἡγοῖτο εἶναι. ἀλλ’, ὦ Μέλητε, οὐκ ἔστιν ὅπως σὺ ταῦτα οὐχὶ ἀποπειρώμενος ἡμῶν ἐγράψω τὴν γραφὴν | ταύτην ἢ ἀπορῶν ὅτι ἐγκαλοῖς ἐμοὶ ἀληθὲς ἀδίκημα· ὅπως δὲ σύ τινα πείθοις ἂν καὶ σμικρὸν νοῦν ἔχοντα ἀνθρώπων, ὡς τοῦ αὐτοῦ ἔστιν καὶ δαιμόνια καὶ θεῖα ἡγεῖσθαι, 28καὶ αὖ τοῦ αὐτοῦ μήτε δαίμονας μήτε θεοὺς μήτε ἥρωας, οὐδεμία μηχανή ἐστιν.

Answer 3

Certainly.

Therefore, if I really believe spirits, as you say, if spirits are some kind of gods, this would be what I say, that you are speaking in jests and riddles, saying that I do not believe in gods while on the other hand saying that I do believe, if indeed I do believe in spirits. But again, if spirits are some kind of illegitimate children of the gods or from nymphs or from any others they are said to be from, what human would believe in the children of gods, but not in gods? It would be similarly out of place just as believing in the children of horses and asses, namely mules, but not believing in horses or mules. But, Mel, there is no way you brought this indictment except to test us with these things or you were at a loss with respect to a true crime you might charge me with – there is no device by which you might persuade any human, even with a small brain, since it is characteristic of them to believe in spirits and gods, and not spirits and not gods and not heroes.