Plato's Symposium! Flashcards
Can you summarise Aristophanes’ argument?
The idea of soulmates! Once there were three genders, but they became too bold and Zeus cut them in half. Those who came from the sole male gender are the bravest. The reason people have sex is to “become one instead of two” - it’s our original state.
Can you summarise Agathon’s argument?
Love is the youngest and most beautiful of the gods, appearing in only ‘soft’ people. “He doesn’t use force, since everyone consents to all Love’s orders.” show’s Agathon’s privilege. You can’t love ugly things (but this is subjective)
What does Gill say about Agathon’s argument?
“It leaves an emotional impression without real knowledge”
“It’s shallow.”
“It’s narcissistic and self-regard who aims at appearances”
The Symposium is Plato’s only dialogue concerned exclusive with love and desire. True or False?
True!
Who was Phaedrus?
A young man, representing the youth of Athens. He’s idealistic and naive, and has a dialogue named after him: Phaedrus.
He was the Eromenos (beloved) of Eryximachus.
He’s an admirer of Socrates and suggests that the topic of conversation should be Eros, as, in his opinion, the god does not get enough praise.
Who was Eryximachus?
A doctor. The Erastes of Phaedrus. He’s meant to speak later, but Aristophanes gets a bout of hiccups, which prevents him from speaking next. A big point is made about moving the speech orders around. Plato WANTED Phaedrus, Pausanius and Eryximachus next to each other!
He broadens the definition of love to include all human and natural processes. He’s pompous and obsessed with his own expertise, imposing it unsuitably on the topic of love.
Who was Pausanius?
A legal expert (lawyer), the Erastes of Agathon. They’re in a long term relationships, which is not the traditional type of pederastic relationships, as it’s their primary one. He strongly argues his point of view, splitting love up into two types and is heavily biased towards male-male relationships.
Who was Aristophanes?
A comedien! He could be there for comic relief, or proof that he, a dramatist, can write comedy just as well as a real comedian!
It’s light-hearted and mythological in scope, but is it meant to be taken seriously?
Who is Agathon?
He was the best tragedian after the core three, but none of his works survive, though he is said to have won competitions.
In the Symposium, he’s celebrating his first win at a dramatic festival. Famously beautiful and the Eromenos (beloved) of Pausanius. He’s self-consciously poetic and rheotorical and is sophistic in style. His argument is easily destroyed.
Who is Alcibiades?
A military general who defected to Sparta, then back to Athens again during the Peloponnesian War.
He’s famously handsome and charismatic and arrives late to the Symposium, very drunk. it’s important that he’s late - he hasn’t heart any of the previous speeches.
Alcibiades and Socrates:
Alcibiades arrives AFTER Socrates’ speech - so he’s heard none of the previous speeches. He’s infatuated with Socrates and is ashamed that he hasn’t been able to seduce him. His speech focuses on Socrates as the object of his desire.
Is he, perhaps, a cautionary tale? This is what happens if you only focus on lust…
Who is Socrates?
A philospher, the mentor of Plato. He’s old, famously ugly and immune to the effects of alcohol and sexual advances.
Uses the ‘Socratic method’ to question Agathon and prove him wrong (pg 32 - 36). He discusses love as a way to reach the Form of Beauty (ladder of love).
Who is Diotima?
A priestess. Socrates claims she taught him about love and reports on her teachings to the others. This means that a woman, technically, gives the most significant lesson of the whole dialogue!
What is Phaedrus’ argument?
He claims that love prevents you from being cowardly or acting in a shameful way. Love encourages you to be better, so you don’t embarrass yourself in front of your loved one. But, this quite an immature view: if you were really courageous, you would be courageous, not just to impress someone.
Why are Phaedrus’ views a bit controversial?
He uses very Spartan views, but this is an Athenian text! Contextually, Athens and Sparta have just fought one another, so this view may not have gone down too well with Athenians.
What mythological examples does Phaedrus use (pg 11)?
Orpheus and Eurydice.
He suggests that Achilles was the beloved of Patroclus, not the other way around.
What was Pausanius’ argument?
He uses the aspect of two origin myths for Aphrodite as symbolising two different types of Aphrodite.
What is Common Love (Pausanius’ Argument)?
Men who love women as well as young boys. This is because that love is driven from lust and attraction. This love is directed at the body, not intelligence and any gratification received from this is bad and immoral.
What is Heavenly Love (Pausanius’ Argument)?
Homerotic relationships. This type of love shows more commitment. You’re more grown up, more mature and more respecful to your partner. Gratification from this type of love is much better!
What does Pausanius do in relation to other states?
He talks about Sparta, Boeotia, Elis and Athens. He’s going over the rules of love in different states.
What does Pausanius say about gratifying lovers?
It is right to do so because it’s for the sake of heavenly virtue and for the state. Having a sexual relationship in the service of the state = pederasty!
Homoerotic relationships, if in service to the state/with an educational aspect are the only reason to have gratifying relationships.
True or False - Pausanius’ sppech is the strongest ancient evidence for the custom of pederasty?
True!
What is Eryximachus’ argument?
He compares love to medicine. If you’re looking after a healthy body - that’s love.
What does Eryximachus say about denying gratification?
He argues that denying gratification is a bit like not treating a diseased part of the body and comapres love to everything.
What, in Eryximachus’ opinion, does good love to do?
Good love causes people to be happy.
What is Alcibiades’ Argument?
He expresses his intense love for Socrates upon arrival and is almost Sappho-esque in the way he desrcibes it “My heart pounds and tears flood out when he speaks” (pg 54).
Alcibiades’ relationship is one-sided and unhappy. Talk about it.
He is frustrated that Socrates keeps turning down his sexual advances: “If I gratified him, I’d be able to hear everything he knew.” (pederasty!)
According to Plato, Alcibiades wants this sex for the right reason = education.
Alcibiades praises Socrates’ endurance and bravery when they were at war together, as well as praising his ideas and philosophies.
“They’re the only ones that make any sense.”
What is the key argument given by Diotima and Socrates?
- Love wants what it does not have.
- Therefore, if love desires what is good and beautiful, love cannot be good and beauitful.
- Love is the desire to have good things forever.
Why do humans strive to reproduce (Socrates’ argument)?
They do it to be immortal. We want to experience good things all the time, and immortality ties into this.
Diotima’s argument: Why did Alcestis, Achilles die for love?
So that their legacy could live on.
“I think it is undying virtue and glorious fame of this sort that motivates everyone in all they do, and the better they are, the more true this is: it’s immortality they are in love with.” Idea of Kleos coming in, but love being linked in.
Diotima’s argument: What two different types of pregnancy are described? What is the difference?
Pregnancy of the mind and pregnancy of the body. Men who are attracted to women express their love by producing children in an attempt to achieve immortality.
Pregnancy of the mind: men who are attracted to other men.
Diotima’s argument: How can love help us to reach the form of beauty?
1) start by loving a beautiful boy.
2) then you will love the beauty of everyone (promiscuity/polyamory?????)
3) appreciating mental beauty.
4) then you can love law, practices and sciences!
5) appreciating the beauty of ALL science and knowledge.
6) then you can see the form of beauty itself.
It’s about moving beyond the physical and basic things.
Diotima’s argument: What are the advantages of reaching the form of beauty?
If you have seen the form of beauty, then beauty and love will be everywhere in your life.
The form of beauty will leak into the rest of your life. If you have seen the form of beauty, your idea-children (had with your male lover) will be the best idea-children ever. Seeing the form of beauty helps you to create better, more virtous ideas and this amazing idea-children could given you the potential for true immortality.
What does Aristophanes say about homoerotic relationships?
“These are the best of their generation…naturally they are the bravest.”
What does Aristophanes say about sex?
“to come together and be fused with the one he loved and become one instead of [is what humans long for].” It’s natural, because people are trying to fuse together to reach their orginal form of being a sphere.
“‘love’ is the name for the desire and pursuit of wholeness.”
What does Aristophanes say about moderation?
If people continue to anger the gods, then there’s a danger that they will split up even further. But, “if we are friends of the god and have him on our side, we shall do what few people now do - find and become close to the loved ones that are really our own.”
Idea of religion and love into worship.
What does Agathon say about love that sounds a bit icky?
“He doesn’t use force, since everyone consents to all Love’s orders.” This suggests the privilege of his life and feels like it’s excusing rape/seuxal assualt.
Is Agathon’s argument easy to read?
It’s full of contradictions.
